man...i gotta tell ya....i just spent 1/2 hr in this thread....there is a ton of good info....great job guys ....cant wait to see it all done....

Well I have been working on paterae ovals for the legs over the last week and still have not finished them. However, I wanted to share some progress to date and show a problem I encountered. When we made the sand shaded fan for the Crazy Leg Table, I missed this sequencing issue completely. Highly advise you to review ATM #15, the paterae fan ovals use the same techniques. While watching the video make sure to notice the sequencing of each wedge (Eli had numbered them), Tommy starts to kinda quickly mentions the sequencing of the wedges. Well my first two results were sequenced 1,2,3,1,2,3 and so on all the way around the oval, which is incorrect. The correct sequence should be 1,2,3,3,2,1,1,2,3,3,2,1.




Notice the numbering on the edges of each fan wedge the fan on the right has the correct sequencing

Did I mentioned I had nine of these sand shaded ovals already with veneer taped and ready to cut the final ovals. Luckily, I was unsure on how I was going to complete the black outline. I used two of this made up ovals and found my error. I will lose about a day to remove all the veneer tape and resequence all the wedges.

After I have finished the paterae, I will post how I did the black outline and cutting the ovals.

Well I have corrected the sequencing on all the made up wedge packet and have cut two ovals. They sure look different then the one's in the previous post. What a difference when you do the sequencing properly.

The two oval in the picture only have veneer tape on the backs and the next step will be to glue them on to a piece of veneer, cut the veneer packet, then band it oval with holly. I will be using hide glue to glue the oval onto the veneer. My reasoning for using hide glue is that it will not interfere with the finish like yellow glue, if it not completely removed from the oval.

With a 5-10 second window for the shading, do you find it's hard to control the amount of color added to the pieces? If a piece was too shaded, would you just trim down the offending side until you get an even shading on all pieces?

Awesome post(s) Chuck!

That is exactly how I am working with the sand shading. Thanks for the question.

Alright Chuck.................back in action and taking no prisoners. You sure are posting the full monte on this build. There is an awful lot of "stuff" going on in your build. Did you loose any wedges?? Seems like one of those fixes that could have been a killer.

Impressive comeback.......Rocky!!!!..........................as he yells..................Adrienne!!!!!!

Great, Great Job Chuck...... I'm loving this post!

Could you provide list of your resources for this project? The specific videos, particular articles, the Charlesworth book you mentioned..... anything you've been reading or referring to I guess.

I'm interested in more of the table construction itself..... like the points you and Eli were making about the hinge.... how the mortise acts as a stop... and the bricking.... whether to veneer the inside or not..... joining those legs to the apron.... great joinery!

Nobody's gonna find info this good on any other forum. Nicely done Chuck

Dave

Dave,

Many of the questions you asked are covered within the thread. But a quick answer is most of the information comes out of Fine Wood Working issue #180 (Steve Latta's federal card table pages 56-63), Tommy's Crazy Leg Table project, Jeffrey P. Greene' American Furniture of the 18th Century, both of Steve Latta's videos, help from Eli and David Charlesworth book volume 2.

Now back to the oval pateraes.


The paterea fans for the legs have been completed. I completed the fans using the same techniques used by Tommy’s video ATM 15. The technique requires the use of shooting boards made up for each specific angle in one quadrant of the oval. (I have pictures of the different steps; if you want me to post them let me know.)

These fans can be made by laying out the oval on some holly than then using an X-acto knife and a straight edge to cut the segments out. Doing this technique is much faster than using individual shooting board for each segment. However, even with great care many times the points of the middle tips of the segments will break off.

There are a lot of different types pateraes that can be made. The sand shaded fan would probability of a 4 or 5 on difficulty a scale of 1-10. There are several easier ones that can be made, however, there a some shells, and others that are much more difficult. The more difficult ones require a good scroll saw and the ability to double bevel marquetry. If you want to buy pateraes, they are available. The commercial ones have been cut by laser and do not have the same sharp lines that hand made ones have. Many times the commercial made patereas are not the right size you may need, however, you can resize them by making a plexiglass oval of the size you require then cut the paterae down and than re-band it. (Steve Latta’s most recent DVD shows how to do this technique.)

After I complete these tables, I may try to make some other style paterea that I have found in my investigation of pateraes.

Side Note: Has anyone else noticed that when the President is shown in the Oval Office there a several federal pieces of furniture in the room?

Due to time constrains, I have decided to use same banding that was made for the Craze Leg Table. Here are some pictures of the process it took for Ken and I to make it. (These pictures are already on the forum in different threads. Tommy's covers the process really well in building the Crazy Leg Table videos.

Nice work on the fans Chuck.... small ones like that must have been pretty tedious to do. I'm remembering the number of hours I had in one big one for project #1

I'm eager to see one of your completed legs with the fan and stringing all done

later

Chuck, This table is really coming together now. The information is great we are getting from you and this build. Keep it up, I am sure a lot of people will use it for there references when it comes time to do similar work, I know I will be.

Dave and Justin,

Thanks for the kind words...these federal tables are time consuming, however, anyone who builds Tommy's Crazy Leg Tables can build these tables. To all those Rough Cutter who have not attempted the Crazy Leg Table build you need to get that project started. It has so many different techniques that can help you down the road in other projects.

I have started making the groove for the banding by using a LN 140 plane...did not want to risk messing up the apron with a slip of the router. I will post some picture later.

Let's chop chop

Well one apron's banding was completed today. I did not want to use a router and make some horrible mistake, so I used a much slower and safer LN 140 block plane. This particular block plane is equipped with a nicker to scores the wood to help prevent tear-out, and the plane is equipped with a fence. Even with having the nicker on the plane, I still went ahead and used a marking guage to score the apron before using the plane. (Better safe than sorry)

man thats cool.....are you gonna run the groove on the leg after you glue up.....i think the banding wraps around right? ...i think it will be easier to assemble then mark and cut the groove ....good job chuck and thanks

Here is a picture of the apron with the two front legs. Just got the pateraes into the front legs today. Tomorrow I will get the back leg paterae into the legs. Does anyone want to see how I go about setting the paterae into the legs, let me know by tomorrow morning by a response on the forum and I will take some pictures of the process I use. From this point forward I will be working at completing only one of these tables, I need to finish it within the next three weeks for the charity it is being donated to. The other table has to be done soon after, I might make a different apron banding for it and the top (when table is open) will have a checkboard with a banding inlay.

wow i need to hurry up...chuck is pulling ahead LOL. I am a little bummed about my bellflowers, there not turning out the way i had hoped. they told me at work to cut out the whole flower instead of three pieces like tommy does. So i figured i'd give it a shot. I only have a few on each leg done, so well see what it looks like when there all in place

Auston,

In my limited research on bellflowers, there seems to be many various interpretations of bellflowers from different regions of the country, as well as, by different builders. Certain parts of the country would cut out the middle petal first, others would cut the middle petal last, some builders made various design of bellflowers where the flower was one piece. Than there was the whole deal of how the bellflowers were arranged on the leg itself. Another words, unless your building an exact reproduction you can take some liberties in the type and arrangements of your bellflowers, stringing, banding, and pateraes.

Hey.............the return of Austin...........where you been Ad?????

Chuck............theses tables are really coming along. I may be late, but I'd like to see the panterea go in, you've taken everybody along this far why not the full show.

I like this C. Middleton line:


That's a well earned line.

Neil

Here is a quick way I do my inlays. Hope these pictures help. Since these are hand made pateraes I could not use a router guide template, each paterae is slightly different is size and shape.

yeah...i'm back LOl i've been really busy latley. i'm finally getting some shop time back

Alright Ad.......Glad you're back.............Chuck's been lonely hanging out on the "Fed Demilune Ledge" . Chuck, those are really good photo's, viewer can very easily see your procedure.

Onr thing that I marvel at at these Fed pieces is the anount of labor that continually adds to the overal complexity. Each operation dovetails with the previous and in some form fits into into the next. I mentioned to Chuck that as he gets closer to completion, he enters deeper into a mine field.

Chuck,
Keep your words and pictures flowing.. this thread is an amazing journey. Thanks for doing such an excellent job breaking down your project into manageable chunks.

Can't wait to see it completed..

Today I dry fitted all parts to the apron and made fine adjustments to the back legs. Still need to cut the top of the legs and add the banding around the legs. There are still some other small details to complete on the legs. However, over the next few days I will start rough cutting the lumber for top and start making it's template.

Thanks, I appericate knowing there are people looking at the process and that someone may be inspired to try to build this table. I am suprised that nobody asked why was plexiglass used for the paterae oval template or used while clamping down the paterae during the glue up.

Well let me explain why...the oval has score marks on the edges were center is on the top and the sides. With the oval plexiglass template having the center lines scored on it, allows one to line up the the sand shaded fan easily prior to cutting out the fan into a oval shape. By using plexiglass as caul while glueing the paterae, allows one to see if the inlay (paterae in this case) is well seated. In addition, yellow glue (PVA) does not stick to the plexiglass. More clamps are need due to the flexibliy of the plexiglass.

Let me explain some another technique used in setting the paterae inlay. After scoring the leg, the outline is defined by using a chisel to remove a small amount of wood to the scored line. This may sound straight foward, but great care needs to be exercised here. Very lite cuts with the chisel are used and pull the small chips toward the center away from the score line, or you run the chance of wood fibers pulling wood out on the other side of the scored line (in this case the outside of the oval).

The little Colt router is the quickest way to remove the bulk of the wood in the center. I left about 1/16" to 1/8" of wood to the oval. A small hand router equipped with a 1/32" pointed bladed was used, The 1/32" pointed blade was used, since it is great at breaking wood fibers in a foward motion and will slice wood fibers using a sideways motion. Also, the point allow you to really get a well defined edge.

One last note about the paterae. After making the paterae, the need to be stored in a press (I am using a couple pieces of 3/4" plywood and several clamps). They warp like there is no tomorrow, if you don't keep them pressed.

Like we have said before, Chuck, awesome job. Not only in the making of this sweet table, but also in documenting and sharing how to do all the little steps and what works (and what doesn't).

No doubt if and when I build a federal card table this thread will be my "must read again".

Keep it up, Cal

whats going on with all theses spammers